Exclusive: Adam Hurrey On The Football Cliches Podcast And His Fascination With The Language Of Football
The language of football is a wonderful thing.
It is familiar, and it is mystifying. It brings people together, and it causes irreparable divides. It draws constantly from everyday conversation and yet exists in a self-contained ecosystem.
Bringing order to something so chaotic and (at times) contradictory is a challenging task.
This is the task that Adam Hurrey has set himself. And, much like an in-form striker finding the back of the net, he does it with aplomb.
The man behind Football Cliches
A writer and editor at The Athletic, Hurrey’s fascination with football’s linguistic curiosities led him to create the Football Cliches podcast in 2020.
He has also written two books on the subject. His second book, Extra Time Beckons, Penalties Loom: How to Use (and Abuse) The Language of Football, released earlier in the year, was longlisted for the 2024 William Hill Sports Book Of The Year award.
Always thought the phrase meant exactly that, great quote from @BookiePrize pic.twitter.com/YcxNtjUHId
— Adam Hurrey (@FootballCliches) October 3, 2024
Regarded as the foremost authority on the rules governing the language of football, Hurrey is consulted whenever a debate concerning the precise phrasing of football-related matters breaks out.
“It’s certainly a label I’ve given myself, but it isn’t just an ego thing,” he says on his status as the self-appointed world expert on the subject. “Half of it is that I know I’ve put more thought into this than most other people.”
“Secondly, and it’s a bit more cynical, but it’s easier to get into the industry. You’ve got to find that little niche that you’re interested in more than anybody else, because it will keep your motivation high, more than anything else. And you’ve got more chance of getting noticed, so that’s half the reason as well.”
The podcast
The Football Cliches podcast sees Hurrey, Charlie Eccleshare, David Walker, and a rotating cast of guest hosts and celebrity invitees examine, in forensic detail, the words, phrases, mannerisms, iconography, and more from the world of football.
At what point can a game accurately be described as a thriller? What differentiates a dink from a chip? What are the permissible contents of a player’s proverbial ‘locker’?
Right then, who's winning #ElClasico??? https://t.co/tV0W4Xqrrk pic.twitter.com/lUUmXM7UeA
— Adam Hurrey (@FootballCliches) October 26, 2024
These, among many others, are the kinds of questions he has to field regularly. Up goes football’s version of the Bat-Signal, and in swoops Hurrey to adjudicate.
“We started off the podcast quite arrogantly. I said, ‘Right, I’m setting the agenda. Everything I’m saying is going to be correct,’ but there have been a few instances over the last couple of years where I’ve been put right about certain aspects of the language of football. It’s made me think, okay, maybe, there is room for discussion here,” explains Hurrey about the evolution of the podcast.
“It’s never our intention to embarrass anybody – it’s a jump-off point into another part of the language. I’m always quite keen to reiterate that. Our intention is never to say, ‘This person said this wrong. Look how stupid they are!’ It’s just, ‘Look how easy this phrase is to get wrong and how strange it is that this phrase ever appeared in the football language in the first place.’”
The Lampardian Transition
A prime example of this is the Lampardian Transition, a particularly niche phenomenon within the language of football that Hurrey first identified almost a decade ago.
It refers to Frank Lampard’s uncanny habit of following a joke with something incredibly serious and earnest in interviews and press conferences. Once you see it, you simply can’t unsee it.
“I’m so proud of having identified it in the first place about 10 years ago. It is a thing, and he does it more than anybody else, and I’m fascinated by it not just as human habit, but as a device to keep things flowing in an interview. The more you think about it, the more you realize that other managers and players do it. It’s a strange thing, and it is rather silly, but I never quite intended for it to be quite so big.”
Footballing fascinations and irritations
“Some people are a bit confused about what turns them on about football,” announces Hurrey. “I don’t mind people getting weird and slightly misguided with their satisfactions and irritations in football because if it is felt on a visceral level, you have to sympathise with it as long as they’re being honest about it.”
The more detailed and honest the better, as far as he is concerned. “I want to hear from people who find really specific things satisfying or skin crawling about football – not just about rules being broken or a ref doing certain things – that’s slightly more pedantic. I want people to explain things they feel on a real DNA level.”
The best part of the podcast?
Whether your passion lies in examining moments from football matches in granular detail or participating in free-flowing thought exercises, Football Cliches has a feature for you.
“My favourite part of the podcast is that sweet spot of a regular episode where we’re sat there and a phrase or a concept comes up and all three of us are having the most natural, flowing discussion about what that phrase means and what thresholds have to be met for it to be triggered in a certain match,” declares Hurrey.
He goes on to add, “I love that stuff. Because I know we’ll get to the right answer, and I know, after four years of doing it now, that there are people out there nodding their heads saying, ‘Yes, they’ve nailed this!’ or shaking their heads going, ‘They’ve got this completely wrong!’ and that’s fine too, I’ve made my peace with that because at least I know that it matters.”
“The greatest thing about it is that 90% of the phrases that we get into and work out when it is that they will be used are phrases that we have all taken for granted over the last three decades or whenever of watching football, and when you’re confronted with them you realise, ‘Oh my god, why do we do that?’ And then, at what point is it valid to use? I love those discussions, they are my favourite bit of the podcast by a mile.”
The Football Cliches fans
Keeping track of every development in football is an impossible task, which is why the podcast offers a unique opportunity for listeners to get involved. The Football Cliches fanbase has become integral to the show’s functioning, and the relationship with the listeners is one Hurrey treasures.
“It’s got to the point now where our listeners are now up to speed, I think, and they are part of the discussion. People present us with something at least one thing a week where we think, yeah, this is absolutely right, we need to calibrate our understanding of the language of football a little bit more. It’s a really flourishing community where people are not just sitting back and listening, they’re engaging as well and we’re all learning together,” he elaborates.
Celebrity guests
The podcast boasts buy-in from prominent personalities within the industry as well, which he finds extremely gratifying. “It’s lovely when people who are part of the industry get involved. Most commentators who I’ve come to know over the last four years or so are really supportive of what we do, and they really enjoy the podcast. I find it very rewarding when people who are paid to write and talk about football listen to the podcast because it means that it’s hitting the right notes and the right tone.”
When asked who he’s been most excited to see pop up in his Twitter mentions, Hurrey replies, “I think Max [Rushden] might be the strangest one, given that he essentially presents a rival podcast. Max is someone I grew up watching on TV and then listening to on the Guardian Football Weekly podcast before I was even involved in this sort of stuff. I’ll get the odd little nod and wink from Jamie Carragher on Twitter every now and then, especially now Likes are private and he can like whatever tweet he wants and nobody will know. I’m still mildly starstruck by these sorts of people – the novelty hasn’t worn off that I’m loosely connected with these people. It’s nice to be pleasing these people, I think, from a purely personal, selfish perspective.”
Opening his spreadsheet of dream guests for the podcasts, he runs through a few names. However, not just any famous face will do.
“It’s something I think about a lot actually – it’s a strange Venn diagram. It would be great to have this person on because they’re famous, and it would boost the profile of the podcast and extend our potential reach. But then there’s the other part of the Venn diagram – do they like football enough to engage with it on this level? And thirdly, will they get the podcast? Have they listened before? Will they understand exactly the niche we get into? If you can find someone who’s in the middle of all three, you’re onto a winner. Unfortunately, there are very few people who fit those three things.”
So, who has done enough to merit a call-up? Ally McCoist is the first name mentioned, closely followed by the stand-up comedian Dara Ó Briain.
Hurrey continues, “Richard Osman, who has essentially politely refused to be on the podcast to the point where I can’t message him anymore. Tim Vine would be excellent – he might be a complete disaster actually, but I’m convinced he would be excellent because he’s incredibly quick-witted and I like quick-witted people – I want people to come on and challenge us, to a certain extent.”
Susie Dent from Countdown’s Dictionary Corner is another hopeful, with her mastery of the English language making her a prime candidate. “I think it’s high time we had an episode where we went purely on the language and didn’t talk about anything else. I do worry sometimes that we haven’t done justice to the core theme of this podcast. We haven’t really got a proper language expert to come and explain, ‘This is the reason we talk about this in a certain way, and this is the reason why this phrase has persisted.’ I think there’s room for that, so I’m insistent on doing that at some point,” he explains.
Hurrey is also hopeful of tapping into the ‘current or recently retired footballer’ market, explaining that a lot of people want to hear from them but most of the time they don’t really have anything to say. “I’m constantly on the hunt for really engaging, expressive footballers who would get what the podcast is about – that, in some ways could be the perfect guest. James Maddison would be so good on Cliches, I’m convinced of it,” he posits.
Pros and cons
Choosing such a niche subject for a podcast comes with pros and cons, but the positives far outweigh the negatives as far as Hurrey is concerned.
“The podcast is never going to be absolutely huge, because there’s a real ceiling to how much people will ever really care about this stuff. The casual, fair-weather football fans, who are completely justified to be casual and fair-weather, by the way, are never going to get into football at this level of detail. This is too niche for them. But the people who do care about it are really invested, and that’s what I get a real sense of value out of,” he explains.
His only regret? Not being able to experience the podcast as a listener.
“The one huge regret about Football Cliches is that I don’t have that distance. I can’t sit back and enjoy it myself. It’s exactly the sort of stuff I would love to read about and listen to, but unfortunately, I have to produce it, so I never get to listen to it.”
Coming full circle
“My desire to codify football’s unique language is founded in a deep affection for it,” declares Hurrey in the introduction to his new book. It is this sentiment that continues to fuel his linguistic endeavours.
“I knew that I was onto something right at the start. I knew I could express myself in a way that would get people thinking, ‘Wow, I never thought about this before, but I experience it every single day.’ That’s a huge appeal to someone who’s reading your work. It’s the same with comedy. It’s the same with really good investigative journalism. If they can shine a light on something that you’ve always had a sneaky suspicion about, then it really fulfills you as a reader. I like to have that effect on people, so that’s how I think it sustained itself all this time. So yeah, to answer your original question, I’m both proud and justified to call myself the world-leading expert, but I don’t mean it entirely seriously.”
